Asking a Thrutopian About Water
Interview with Rupert Read by Clare Whistler
‘Flow Conversation’ with thrutopian Rupert Read by Clare Whistler
“We met on a day in February, a chance coincidence that Rupert had one sliver of time available when I, who live in East Sussex, was for another reason in Norwich on the day he offered. I took a bus from the centre out to sit in his garden room, looking over the straggles of squash and marrow plants, and we talked with a gourd between us. I read him the story of the River Soldier and asked him three questions. The words we spoke became the material for this Flow Conversation which is presented as a kind of found poetry.”
water always finds a way through… water always finds a way through… water always finds a way through… i. glass: asking a thrutopian about water… on a hot day savour that drink of water register qualities of taste the substrates of flavour do you think it boring or not notice water at all (water’s not a substance, it’s a thing) First tell a story about water. Find the words to bring us in touch with all it is. On a planet held together by gravity and fed by rain Running water A planet where every creature depends on water Running water As necessary as food, sleep, parents, air Running water Fed by rain Life and health of the waters flowing into our lives Fed by rain Life and health of the same waters as they flow out of our lives A glass of water Living in Norfolk A sort of water county Sort of has a moat River boundaries Broads sea Fed by rain Marshland coast Deserted beach Fast moving channels Running water A water-based place in a glass of water on the rocks of the rockford saints
ii. gourd: asking a thrutopian about water
between us
a gourd
spread space-ship shape
with soft frill
fade green to nearly mute white
a holder of water
made of water
are we in balance
water vessels ourselves
slowly shrinking waterbodies
a squash takes water to become water
we take water to become water
are we in balance
our similar insides
we value differently
but being water is being life
for both of us and the gourd
our three bodies
side by side
water-logged
like we’re seals
on the same beach
shuffling down
look back shuffling
every few shuffles
we turn and give a look back
as if amazed
give a long look back as if amazed
to be allowed freedom
convinced we’ll capture death
an end of a civilisation
is right behind us
we shuffle and look
shuffle and look
as we meet the water
we give our seal selves the sea
and give the sea ourselves seals
we give the seal sea song
and all is well
in the swells
iii. Hope... asking a thrutopian about water
we are more vulnerable than people realise
there is the vulnerability of water too
in a time of death
get ready for a life
find ‘presence’
against collapse and fear
our feelings will move us
move us change us
they are the great connectors
change us move us
to spiritual adaptation and the authentic divine
To reverence water is wisdom
make blessings
from old and all scriptures
To reverence water is to find prudent stewardship
explore your own watersheds
To reverence water
make rituals
be water-based
there is the vulnerability of water
misuse drought poison
we are more misuse than people realise
flood disease flow
To reverence water
start to move away from our
water and wastewater systems
Water’s not its substance, it’s a faith
I believe if these sacred beaches were threatened
I would do what I could to defend my deserted place
An imposing thought
I would do a lot - what?
let’s plan....
we are going on through...
as water goes on through...
water always finds a way through...
Philosopher and environmentalist Rupert Read created the theory of ‘thrutopia’ for narratives of practical storytelling detailing how we create a flourishing future, and is co-director of the Climate Majority Project.
More about thrutopia in his own words:
“Despite the extreme challenges we face, in fact to put it more precisely, because of the extreme challenges we face, we could be on the cusp of a flourishing future if we imagine something other than dystopias and utopias.”
“Everywhere and everyone is now on the climate frontline. As a result, we need action, not just activists. The Climate Majority Project aims to help a majority of people in the UK who care about climate and nature – i.e who care about our very future – to understand that they are powerful together, and to take meaningful action, relevant to themselves and their communities. As well as ‘practical’ action, we advocate the importance of cultures of support, political inclusivity and resilience: to help us face the trouble we’re in together.”
Clare Whistler describes her work as elemental, is an interdisciplinary artist who works in performance, site-specific work in landscape, poetry, music, dance, visual art, and always in collaboration. Currently on residency with WATERSHED, a project with Charlotte Still at Blackshed Gallery, she interviewed Rupert Read through the prism of water following their introduction at The School of the Anthropocene.
River Soldier by David James Duncan, short story published in Whole Terrain: Reflective Environmental Practice (Antioch, Serious Play, 2000/2001)
May Sarton’s poem A Glass of Water (Collected Poems 1930 - 1993, W. W. Norton 1993)
Active Hope by Joanna Macy is the ‘Hope’ in section iii, one of Rupert Read’s teachers.
Would you like to plant a squash?
Let gardener Simon Akeroyd show you how in his own silent way.
Oh yum! What a fresh, creative way to present an interview. The seal stanza especially liquefied me, and the last lines...